Attracting New Business Through Value Alignment with VP Tim Vennard and Marketing Wizard Ben Houck of Mazzone Hospitality
Tim Vennard - Vice President of Mazzone Hospitality with more than 15 years in company leadership. Tim’s been innovating the food industry through catering, restaurants, and corporate cafes. He was essential in growing Mazzone Hospitality with some of the biggest clients in the pharmaceutical, microchip manufacturing, and finance Industries. He has been recognized for his leadership by Restaurant Associates and Compass Group, as a trendsetter domestically and worldwide in food service. As leader of Mazzone Hospitality he has his eyes fixed on the growth of the brand and influence throughout the Northeast. He is also the company softball/volleyball/basketball coach and our Notorious B.I.G. karaoke king.
Ben Houck - Marketing Wizard - has served Mazzone for 7 years with his hand in not just marketing, but IT, HR, Accounting, Operations, and Sales. He took squeezing every bit of value out of his MBA quite literally. When Mazzone was tasked with what title should be put on a Chef coat, "wizard" seemed to be the only title fitting of Ben. Recently, Ben has been writing for regional business journals on "Food as an Employee Benefit" and hopes to spread the culture of hospitality throughout business and organizations.
Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:
Discover the perspective of Mazzone Hospitality on Managing Food Service as an employee benefit.
Tim emphasizes the advantages of aligning values in marketing.
Ben discusses how food can serve as an additional tool for hiring and retention.
Explore how exclusive locations attract audiences and boost revenue.
Embrace the integration of AI in the food and hospitality industry.
Tim’s preference for quality over consistency.
What you’ll learn in this episode:
In today’s landscape of modern business, companies are constantly seeking innovative ways to attract and retain top talent. Corporations and companies are turning break rooms and cafeterias into centers of collaboration and revitalization. High-quality meals not only nourish employees physically but also spark creativity and strengthen connections among colleagues. Furthermore, offering a variety of culinary experiences showcases a dedication to employee well-being, resulting in increased morale and loyalty.
In essence, food isn't just about sustenance—it's a recipe for success in cultivating a thriving workplace culture and securing top talent.
In this episode of From Persona to Personal, Roger Hurni welcomes Tim Vennard, VP of Mazzone Hospitality together with Ben Houck, their marketing wizard, to discuss how they transformed a company that began as a diner into a leading corporate dining brand catering to large corporations and hosting exclusive events. Their innovative perspective and marketing strategies have reshaped clients' perception of food from a basic necessity to a valuable employee benefit, fostering a stronger company culture and driving higher productivity.
Resources mentioned in this episode:
This episode’s sponsor:
Today’s episode is brought to you by Off Madison Ave. At Off Madison Ave, we create meaningful moments of brand trust and influence how people interact and engage with brands.
There is a science behind tapping into your audiences’ desires and motivation. After all, if you’re not changing your audiences’ behaviors, you can’t truly unlock all of your brand’s potential.
The proven models and methods of Behavior Design are the strategic foundation for your brand’s success.
Episode Transcript
Intro 00:02
This is From Persona to Personal podcast. Today's episode is brought to you by Off Madison Ave. Off Madison Ave creates meaningful moments of brand trust and influences how people interact and engage with brands. The science behind their approach taps into your audience's motivations and desires. After all, if you're not changing your audience's behaviors, you can't truly unlock all of your brand's potential. Now, let's get started with the show.
Roger Hurni 0:33
Hello, everyone! I am Roger Hurni, the host of From Persona to Personal, where it gets used, my expertise in consumer behavior to engage with top business leaders who are propelling their brands forward before we get to today's guests. This episode is brought to you by off Madison Ave and Off Madison Ave. They provide holistic marketing that inspires people to visit cities, attractions, and the great outdoors. Their behavior models tap into your audience's motivation and prompt them to shift behavior. This allows them to specialize in answering the question, where to next? Then point in the point those customers in the best possible direction. Yours. To learn more, visit offmadisonave.com. Go. See. Do. Now without further ado, I have not one but two very special guests today. This is actually my first time doing an interview with two guests. So, we'll see how this goes. No promises everyone. The first is Tim Vennard, who is the Vice President of Mazzone Hospitality, with more than 15 years in company leadership. Tim's been innovating in the food industry through catering restaurants and corporate cafes. He was essential in growing Mazzone Hospitality with some of the biggest clients in pharmaceutical, microchip manufacturing and finance industries. He has been recognized for his leadership by restaurant associations and Compass Group. Transcending trendsetters domestically and worldwide food service. As a leader at Mazzone Hospitality, he has his eyes fixed on the growth of the brand and the influence throughout the northeast. Little side note about Tim that they kind of threw in there, which I really, really dig is that he's also the company softball, volleyball, and basketball coach and a notorious B.I.G. karaoke king, which maybe he'll break into some song for us. His counter. Oh, yeah, Tim, I'm going to put you on the spot. His counterpart is Ben Houck. You can correct the pronunciation later. HOUCK. He is the marketing wizard and served at Mazzone for 7 years with his hand in not just marketing, but IT, HR, accounting, operations, and sales, clearly a jack of all trades. He took, squeezing every bit of value out of his MBA quite literally when Mazzone was tasked with the type what the title should be to put on his chef coat and wizard seem to be the most seeming fit for Ben. Recently Ben has been writing for regional business journals on food as an employee benefit which we'll get more into and hopes to spread the culture of hospitality throughout the business and organizations. What did I mess up, boys? Welcome to the show.
Ben Houck 3:25
Yeah, thank you so much, Roger, for rolling out the red carpet for us. We're just glad to be on the show, and then glad to talk to you and pick your brain about marketing. And hopefully, we can share some good insights on what we've been doing as a brand, and what we think the hospitality industry has in store.
Roger Hurni 3:40
Well, we're starting off right? Because that was the longest intro of any podcast. I've ever done.
Ben Houck 3:47
Well, hopefully, everybody's still with us. And now we're going to get to the good part here.
Roger Hurni 3:50
Alright. Well, thanks, Ben. You know what I maybe, Tim, you can start off with this question. I'd like to have you tell me a little bit more about Mazzone Hospitality. What was the inception for the idea and kind of a brief history.
Tim Vennard 4:08
Yeah, sure. So long story. I'll keep it short. I don't have the 30. We don't have time for 35 years of history right now. But Angelo Mazzone, our founding father, if you will, started his company, basically had a diner in Schenectady, and then sort of expanded into a banquet space with basically no money. And the story quick story behind that is. he built half of it, and he and he had borrowed money, and he went back to the bank and said, well, I don't have any more money, and they said, well, I guess we better let you borrow some more money so you could finish the project, and then you can pay us back. So, he basically was able to work that to the point where he grew a brand based on, you know, relationships. And you know, being in the community. Fast forward to 2008 to the recession, we built an entire brand focusing on corporate dining. And that was basically because every you know, every wedding, every event that was social had canceled because the market had crashed, and there was no expendable income left, and hence the birth of prime dining which now exceeds more than 50% of our revenue yearly and has become actually the stronger part of our business right now. So, there's a whole lot in between there, a lot of acquisitions, a lot of on-site locations, a lot of growth, a lot of pains along the way. But to keep it brief, we are. We are a family-run business with family morals, and Angelo is our guiding light still. But we are onto the next generation of how we grow this company forward.
Ben Houck 5:41
Yeah. And somewhere in between there, you know, we had 7 or 8 full-service restaurants. I think we're at 12 exclusive catering venues you know. Come and gone trunk, and then we've signed different leases for different places. And really, the footprint is throughout all of upstate New York, and we're looking to expand to the northeast and certainly westward into New York. And you know, we're the leading caterer in upstate New York. And so that's the other kind of 50% that Tim was alluding to is. You know, a big chunk of its catering, and then a big chunk of it's this managed services food. It is an employee benefit for the area's biggest companies, whether they're pharmaceutical companies or microchip manufacturers or financial industry. All those folks. They're all hungry at work, and we'd like to feed them.
Roger Hurni 6:26
So, I know the pandemic is in the past at this point, but what you do literally means getting people around the table and feeding them. So how did you navigate the pandemic? And were the lessons learned that you've carried forward.
Ben Houck 6:44
Yeah, that was huge. So thankfully, through great partnership of our clients, they held right on through the pandemic, a lot of them being in manufacturing, you know their manufacturing presses quote unquote, didn't stop right. They had to keep putting out product so through as safe and means as possible what we were doing, a grab and go program for a lot of our clients, so that, you know they had this heightened sense of safety. But we were able to pump out food right along with them, even though you know kind of how we alluded to in 2008. You know the recession-proof part of this, or and we could call it a little bit pandemic-proof is that you know, those folks still had to go into their jobs and manufacture goods and services, and so we were able to stay there with them and feed them. And I think a lot of folks actually preferred that because it was a one-stop shop going to their employers, they could get their food. They could work through the day and then go back home to a place of, you know. Reasonable safety, you know, and in early 2020, we didn't know, you know. So, I think a lot of people were so happy to just be able to go to work, know that there was going to be good food there, and not have to make extra stops on the way home, and so we were very lucky that you know, that manage services, and our clients, our corporate clients. We're still serving lunch all the way through that, and that was seen as a huge employee benefit during the pandemic. And so, you know, we're kind of parlaying off of that even post pandemic of like. If this was, it was super valuable during the pandemic to provide food for your employees. It's even more valuable now, and it always has been valuable to provide food for your employees. So that's the message that we're definitely pushing and something, I think, got only reinforced by the pandemic.
Tim Vennard 8:11
And my greatest lesson learned from that, the strength of relationships with clients is the most important thing. When it comes to, you know, how can we take care of each other? At the end of the day, they came to us and said we want to make sure that you guys are taken care of, and we want you to take care of us. And that only comes from the trust and the relationships that that we built with our clients.
Roger Hurni 8:33
Makes perfect sense. It makes perfect sense. You mentioned this for, and Ben, I'll ask this because you specifically pointed this out. You've talked about food as an employee benefit. I think you've alluded to it in the last bit of the conversation, but I'd like you to just expand upon that. What's beneficial to owners, and to make sure that, you know they're doing things the right way from an employee benefit standpoint.
Ben Houck 9:03
Yeah, absolutely. So, any company that hires employees, you know, they're competing to have the best employees, the best talent in their company. And one way to do that is by offering better wages and better benefit packages, right? And so, food is an employee benefit. Not only it is a productivity thing, because once you're at the job, you know, having food there so you don't have to leave. Having coffee there so that you can get there earlier, having that afternoon snack there so that you can stay later and get the project done. You know there's all sorts of productivity benefits, but we really see it as a retention tool as well as a hiring tool as well as kind of like a sales culture thing, right is, you know, we've all seen mad men where they go to the conference room, and they've got this fancy catered lunch, and they help seal the deal right on the new things. So, having a cafeteria or a food service in your business helps you do all those things. Employee retention, increase productivity, increase sales and helps seal the deal with executive catering and lunches and things like that. And so, we see it as like this whole culture of hospitality, and a way to add to corporate culture. You know, we've all seen the memes online, too, of, like, you know, I worked in my cubicle 364 days on the last day of the year they threw us a pizza party, you know. We really want to squish that and make it feel like, you know, your employees value in our offering. This is a true benefit with all the great things that food can offer. Whether you know a Deli station, pizza station, full-service grill. And then, really, what we've leaned into because of our fine dining background is having these elevated meals available at reasonable prices for employees. Right? So, you're serving things like, hey, ossobuco and salmon, and some of the things that you would expect on a restaurant menu, and not necessarily on a cafeteria menu. And that kind of it gives you something to look forward to work. Beyond just you know, I got to go to my cubicle and get my stuff done, and it makes work less transactional when you know I'm going to have this great meal with my coworkers, or with a client, and going from there. So, there's a lot to unpack there as food as an employee benefit and especially on the HR side. You know you get into numbers and dollars and cents of like, what does it cost? And I always try to tell clients and other folks. You know, minimum wage is like $15 an hour, and when you do the math of you know any business that has, you know, like 500 at least employees for like a dollar a day, you can have a corporate cafeteria per employee, and they can have the option of buying all this great food. Right? So, it's very minimal compared to their wages, but it has this outsize benefit to the employee of knowing. I don't have to worry about where my first cup of coffee in the morning is coming from. I don't have to worry about, you know, getting lunch as I'm putting my kids on the school bus, or as I've got all these extracurricular activities with my family after work. And then, obviously, you know, late in the day, too, is like I can grab that Gatorade from the retail area. Or you know that snack bar as I'm going to my kid’s Soccer game or something like that, right? So, there's all these convenience aspects of it, too that just makes your employment in your office more of a, I won't call an island, but a place where you want to be, as opposed to just transactional that I have to go to work, collect my paycheck and go home kind of thing.
Roger Hurni 12:10
Well, I mean the tangible benefit there is increased productivity. I mean, you know, like we're all capitalists here, like, you know. Call it what it is. It's great that it's a benefit, and I'm sure somebody at some point can do some kind of cost analysis to demonstrate that point. What I find fascinating about it is, and I still spoke to similar kinds of companies like yourself. It's you're the only one that has carved out a unique market position using food as an employee benefit. And I think that's a really great position to own and occupy as a as the marketing guy. I think that's just really smart to continue to leverage that from a marketing perspective which goes.
Ben Houck 12:55
We were Googling it, and I was just surprised how few articles there were. You know you can search corporate cafeterias and some nice things about Hallmark Company out in the Midwest will come up about always offering food for your employees. But really it was kind of a term that I hadn't seen online in in, in on the Internet, and as well as you know, as we're pitching clients, we always put it up next there, next to you know, health insurance and a company car and 401K-mash, and all those kind of things, and because of its nature of, you know, companies. They can write it off as a benefit for their employees. You know it's in a similar accounting line on your sheet there, you know, really making employees see it as that, and not that they're buying food is just a nice thing, is that it's you know. You put it in the same accounting line as an employee benefit.
Roger Hurni 13:43
You, you know, part and parcel about this, and maybe, Tim, this is best answered by you, but the venues are also this other portfolio of. I mean, they all look amazing. What made the organization want to create a list of properties like that? And what's the criteria?
Tim Vennard 14:03
You know it's a good question. Oh, you know, we're upstate New York, obviously, right? So, we, there's limited footprint, you know, New York City. There's a venue on every corner, if you will. and I think you know what Angelo saw and what we still carry on today. Are these jaw dropping venues when you walk in, and you just look at them, and you're just immediately attached, and you want to have your wedding there and regardless. So, I think it's some somewhat of owning market share, if you will. I think it's, you know, with other caterers not being exclusive in these venues. It basically captures our audience and drives top line revenue. By having these exclusive jaw dropping locations. I mean, we think about you know the Infinity Pool at Saratoga National, where you're overlooking the eighteenth green, you know, and you're looking up the Tenth Fairway, or you walk into the Hall of Springs, where it's, you know. I don't even know 50-foot ceilings where it's just all inspiring. And you can, you know it's right down to Coxsackie, where you're in, you know, on the wire, right on the Hudson River, which is all these is great. And I think what we've done is, and part of my goal with the expansion is to find more of these exclusive locations. That basically in a nutshell, sell themselves and enjoy that. And we've taken those properties now, and we're actually flipping them into our corporate side of the business, and we're trying to get those folks to know that, hey, we're more than just a food service company in your cafeteria. What we can provide are these things that are outside of the norm, where, if you need to have your holiday party, or retreat or whatever it is, for you know, mind-level folks or high-level executives, we can. We can do it all for you. So, it's sort of been our stronghold in our market, if you will, to have these venues in the catering business. I don't want to say, nothing's a guarantee. People can choose to go where they want to choose. But you know, we you know we live by, you know, very simple motto. We create great food and give great service, and the rest of it takes care of itself. So, it's kind of how we've done it.
Roger Hurni 15:55
Makes sense. Yeah, I've spoken to other kinds of hospitality organizations like yourselves. Theoretically, you could say some of them are competitors, maybe not competitive geography wise, but as far as being a similar business model. You seem to have approached a level of detail that most everyone I've spoken to may not really have gotten really a good grasp of. So, I'm not trying to throw this as a curve ball to you, but I am curious as to, when do you lose? like when does someone not choose you? Is it? Is it a price thing? Or because I mean, it feels like this is a no brainer that you'd be able to just knock off Op Contracts left and right and expand beyond the northeast.
Tim Vennard 16:48
Yeah. So, we say this a lot when we start. So, we've just started talking with a new client. And I can remember when we started to build the business on the you know, on the manage service side. Were we can't be everything to everyone, and we're aware of that. So, you know, our price point might be slightly higher than some of our competition. But the level of service you get with that is, and the food you get with that is represented by that price point. So, we look for partners that have like values and similar thoughts. We know we can't fit into everybody's box, and I think that's kind of been the strength of how we've grown. The managed-service side is, we don't take what we do at X employee, or and then take it to X employer and say, this box fits inside of that box. We customize it to what their needs are. As long as the alignment is there with, you know, food is not just a service. Food should be an amenity to your employees, and as Ben alluded to or said, actually, you know, it should be viewed as the same thing as healthcare, or anything that is given to an employee to entice them to stay.
Ben Houck 17:49
Yeah, it's so hard when you get that question not to. You know. Name your competitors. You know there's literally coming on my MBA, I remember that was the first thing I did from his own hostile be like. Here's the top 5 competitors in our area. And they're, you know, massive multinational companies. And we've seen, even in the catering side people, you know, fly in for one event, do it and fly out of our area where we're, you know, dominate, you know. So, we realize that there's competition everywhere, and especially in the food. Oh, I say, like the Ratatouille line, “anybody can cook”, but it's kind of a thing is like, I think anybody can bring in a truck, pull off a really great event and be out of our area in the same weekend, you know, I mean, so we know that we have to set the bar really, really high for people to keep choosing Mazzone in upstate New York. And you know we're hoping we're attracting folks from the northeast to New York, and up and down the eastern seaboard. You know but in by having, like, I think, Tim's point, by having the relationship with those amazing venues at the Saratoga track, at, you know, Premier Golf Course at the Empire State Plaza. Those are all like kind of tourist destinations. People are already flocking to, and by having those down. You know, we're building those relationships further, establishing things.
Roger Hurni 19:02
Well, I mean, not. All new business is good business, and you certainly are not in the transactional game. I actually love the idea that you basically attract new business through value alignment more than probably anything else. And I think that's a good lesson to be learned by a lot of companies that this you know, you have to work with. You know these clients, and if their values don't align, then they're probably not going to be a good fit. And that's okay. Is that a fair assessment?
Ben Houck 19:34
Absolutely. I think that goes back to that pizza party meme, right? It's like I worked all year for a corporate party pizza party, right? We don't really want pizza party clients. We want the folks who are going to lean in a little bit more and understand that what they're offering to their employees is significant through food, and not just the one off. You know.
Roger Hurni 19:51
Is that has been? Has that value alignment and food as an employee benefit? Is that, has that been your best marketing strategy? And how do you go to the to market with that messaging if so?
Ben Houck 20:05
I think it's a lot of education through things like our business journals and newspapers and getting people to buy in that way. And getting them to tour our facilities is probably the biggest thing seeing is believing right is showing. Bring them some of our flagship spots of what a nice clean space, and what all your employees get together for a big event, and how they react in the big event? And how they've latched onto one another that way. Right is like the building memories together through a holiday party or building memories together through a company picnic or building memories together through those things. And then suddenly, you've got all the stickiness, right? And so, the combination of those 2 is educating the dollars and cents part of it. You know the MBA part of it of you know this is how much it's going to cost you, and this is how you can see it per employee and all the food benefit part of it, but then also the extremely personal side of it is like. You know, this HR person stayed on longer because they felt really empowered to throw this great picnic, or this person stayed on longer, because they made a best friend at X-party or X-lunch or X-sales meeting, you know. And so those things, I think, go hand in hand, as well as you know, educating through our local journalistic outlets, but as well as getting them in house and showing them and making them believers that hey, real relationships are built over breaking bread, real relationship. Built over something that's a little nicer than a box of donuts or slice of pizza. Right. I'm going to beat that meme to death. But it's so true, and I think all of our millennials down Gen Zers and then on will fully understand that.
Roger Hurni 21:38
Yeah, no, I you know it's I've told people for the companies that I've own and all the employees. I call them Staffers, affiliate employee. You work for the person stuff you work with the person. But I've said I never want us to hire anyone I don't want to have lunch with. Like, that's my, that's my litmus test right there. It's like if I'm willing to have lunch with you. Then, you know, that's the first step to possibly being someone who can be on staff. I have another question, and I'll be honest with you. It's for me more than maybe for you. My next book is going to be focusing on AI and customer experience. You're in a people business. Maybe this doesn't affect you at all. Maybe you're doing some things behind the scenes. But I cannot not ask this question. Is AI affecting any of your marketing strategies or your business operations? Are you doing anything? Are you ignoring it? Just? Can you give me a sense of.
Ben Houck 22:34
No, absolutely. We're very much, I love the topic of AI. I love talking about it so much that I signed this up for an event. Next week in Albany. It's called AI and Digital marketing with a great local advertising company called, “Over IT”, we're providing the food for it, and we have outsourced some of our data and some of our IT to a group called E15. They're part of the Compass Group and arm of Compass Group that does really great work with Oh, God! What is it called when it's already thinking of what food products you need to order before you know you need them. So, what is that generative ordering? And…
Roger Hurni 23:12
It's predictive ordering, almost.
Ben Houck 23:14
Right. So, it's taking what our chefs are already ordering week to week to week and adding new products to that that they know will already fit into our thing. So like if they know we're selling, you know, X water products and all, you know, just for the beverage category of our category of our cafes. They know, hey, this new product came on the market where it's going to automatically recommend ordering that indoor cafe. Because in other markets in Boston, in New York or Philly. It's selling X well, and then it can spew out this whole data sheet of we expect if you sell this product, you'll sell this many units by your population, and then kind of generate this kind of product, this kind of profit at these margins and prices, right? And so like, it's super heavy in the data ends is how Mazzone Hospitality is using AI in that predictive food by ordering that way. And then in the customer facing side of it, we really see it through kiosk ordering and online ordering, right? So almost 50% now of our clients’ orders go through either a digital kiosk or through their phones or are online before they even get to the cafe. Right is like more and more cashiers are going away. More and more of these electronic middlemen are going to be there. And so even in those, there's predictive ordering for the customer, they say, hey, we noticed you're vegetarian, or maybe your gluten free, hey, this new item came on the menu. Can we recommend this to you? Right. So, all those recommendations and food and making it a more personalized experience using AI is what I'm really fascinated by, and I can't wait to see more of that. Yeah, that's probably our best fast ball with AI in the food industry. I'm sure there's going to be tons of ways that it'll affect us that I don't even know about yet, but those are the two I'm most excited about.
Roger Hurni 24:48
I think it’s one conversation you and I are going to have to have. I'm sorry, Tim, go.
Tim Vennard 24:51
Yeah, sorry if I can add to that. I mean. I don't think you can be a business in this generation in this era in this year and say, is AI is not going to affect us? You know I was in that generation where you know I went from a pager to a cell phone to you know I still remember when there were no, none of that. So, you know I've we've embraced it as a company, and I look forward to what it brings. I mean, I've seen things we're doing on a high level, as a corporation now, where we're doing virtual training where it actually feels like you're in the room with that person, you know, using whatever they are. VR glasses, you know, and it and the effect of it is that you're still getting somewhat of a personal effect on it but you're not even in the room. So, we're not flying people halfway across the country to do training anymore. And the savings on that are astronomical. And you're still getting the personal reaction because you're getting the feel and the touch of it. So, there's a ton of it to come. I go back to like when the internet. I mean, I wasn't there when the Internet was birth, but I can imagine it's very scary for businesses at this time as well. When the Internet came out. you know. Now we're talking about a whole another thing that we have to adapt to. But if you're not adapting to it, you're going to, it's going to fly right by you.
Ben Houck 26:00
And that's kind of why I've loved the hospitality industry. Is that AI, it doesn't scare me. It's just another piece of technology. And you know we've talked about the pandemic and the 2008 recession, the beauty of food and hospitality. People will always need a place to eat and drink and be married together. And you know, so no matter what happens. I know there's going to be a human role in food. And so, I'm totally in embracing it, and I know other marketers in my shoes are kind of scared because I use generative AI all the time when I'm making marketing, whether it's through Photoshop or, you know, making short clips of video just to have some B role. Or, you know all those great things we've seen chat GPT. You know. I think there's a lot of that to be nervous about as far as what jobs are going to be there? But in the food industry. I think we can embrace it and use it to improve the customer experience and ultimately make less paperwork. Hopefully, you know what I mean.
Roger Hurni 26:53
Yeah, generative AI is great. But the future isn't generative AI, because it's not savvy generous. It's taking information that already exists and finding correlations, and that can lead into some predictive stuff. I started an AI company in 2016, you know, and the AI we use in LighthousePE, is a learning AI, so it can make behavioral predictability and learn based on implicit as well as explicit behaviors. Yeah, every company should be doing that, and I think you're very, very smart to embrace it. You are among the few because of everyone that I've had these conversations with, I would probably say 10% are just like full boat. Let's figure it out. Let's keep going. Let's do what we need to do. There's probably 40% that are, I'm in the experimentation mode. We're not sure how to use it. We need to write AI policies. And then there's 50% that are like. I'm freaked out and sadly, if they don't get out of that mode, they will not be in business 5 years from now.
Ben Houck 28:01
Right, I hope experts like yourself, and like I said, our local experts again, I got to plug over it. They're an amazing advertising company, they've had these great webinars. And like I said, we're doing one next Wednesday. And so, the best thing I would tell people who are nervous or scared about AI is just to get more and more educated, just like any technology is, it becomes way less scary once you know more and more about it. Cause like you said, the generative stuff is already not scary to you, because you know the plot holes in it. Right? You know where its pitfalls are and so I think, working around it and seeing how we can see into the future with it is the best path.
Roger Hurni 28:35
You. You mentioned two or three companies that I would like to make sure you give me the web links for, so that I can put in the show notes for all the listeners and stuff.
Ben Houck 28:45
For sure!
Roger Hurni 28:46
Alright, so AI is the future, let's stick to that theme. I only have a couple more questions to get through since AI is the future. I would like to talk about the future of the Mazzone Hospitality. Are there plans to expand beyond the region that you're in? Like I said, it seems like you've got this business model and really dialed down. What’s the…
Tim Vennard 29:10
There are plans, and you know, without disclosing too much. We find ourselves; our niche is that we are a solid like, B-city company, meaning we're not, you know. We're not a New York City company. We're not a Boston company. We're not a Chicago Company. We figured out how to navigate the market. That's not that big and, and, you know, get everything we can out of it. So future goals are most immediate is western New York. We're really trying to get us, you know, some kind of foothold in the Rochester area, and we feel it's very similar to the Albany market, only much, you know, much larger, but still on that sort of upstate New York Vibe. We'd like to expand regionally. We're doing a lot of work, sort of going out the corridor towards Massachusetts. And you know, out in Connecticut. So, it's going to be slow growth as we come, because we want to make sure we do it right. But what we've done recently over the past year is we, you know I reorg the company to be set up for growth. So, it's no longer it's no longer. Oh, we don't have this VP to run this area, we just need to add one more of these. And now we can expand out to X and that… go ahead.
Roger Hurni 30:23
No, just so, knowing all that. What's keeping you up at night? What's the biggest challenge that you're facing right now?
Tim Vennard 30:31
For me personally, it's making sure that what we built remains the same. So, having that level of quality and consistency in place of what got us here, and what you know, what created everything that surrounds us today remains the same. So, it's the one thing that actually does keep me up at night is, you know, if I walk into any unit, you know I was one of the first chefs in this entire company, and you know, when I go in and see something that's not the way it was or should be to our company standards. That's what keeps me up at night and you know that's sort of the point of the reorg where we took folks. And we said, okay, you're the best of the best, this is the standard that we have to uphold. I can't worry about that if we're going to grow the company. So that's really been what keeps me up at night is, you know it. I think that's true with any company, right like you can't lose what got you to where you are, and that level of quality has to remain the same. So don't grow too fast. You know, make sure every make sure those checks and balances are in place, and then you know, once you're comfortable with that, then you can kind of step out and expand, and that's just about where we are. We're probably a few months away from at least, me personally, feeling 100%.
Ben Houck 31:38
Give credit to Tim and our senior leadership, you know they've stacked the bench, and I think that's what's really helped us is that we feel confident with the chefs we have in place to lead their own units and be creative and do really high-level work. Where a lot of other organizations to do what we do in the many services and corporate cafeterias. It's a very cookie cutter, and they think they can place anybody in any kitchen and get really great products and really high-level service. You know, they do standard quarterly menus, and just say, cook to this recipe the exact same way every single time, and I think our approach of finding really, really talented people is saying to your chef, “Go be a chef. cook as well as you know. Cook your brains out, you know. Cook at a really high level of a really high level service, and everything else will figure itself out, you know, I mean, and we don't get lost in the minutia of you know this is our brand standard, and our ranch dressing has to be exactly the same ranch dressing all the way through everywhere, you know, or this menu has to be exactly the same, you know, and we understand there's economies of scale and efficiencies and those things. But I think it's so much more important to lift the creative side and let our chefs and our people be people and build those relationships organically, as opposed to saying, ‘You are company robot, do company robot stuff’, you know. So, I hope the analogy works.
Roger Hurni 32:55
Yeah, I used to work for an agency that was like, how good can you? How big can we get before you get bad. It's the problem with, you know, great restaurants that become chains. You know, they get bad because they start focusing on consistency as opposed to quality of the product and the individual on an individual basis, I guess, for like.
Ben Houck 33:20
Much better. Analogy, honestly, is the Chain restaurant.
Roger Hurni 33:24
When I asked the question about what challenges are you facing now that would keep you up at night, I was really hoping, Ben, you weren't going to say, like getting to be coming a ninth-level wizard or something like that.
Ben Houck 33:33
No, no.
Tim Vennard 33:34
I gave him that name by the way.
Ben Houck 33:36
Cool, Tim coined that. Well, really, what you don't want to see coming out of the kitchen is a guy who has “marketing manager” on a Chef coat, right? Nobody wants the marketing manager to cook their meal. They want somebody, you know, culinary special, you know. So, Wizard just seems to make a little bit more sense.
Roger Hurni 33:55
There's a company I work with in LA called Company 3, and the person who owns it works on famous movies, and that is amazing. He colors the film and he’s received the title “Chancellor of Color”. So, I'm not big on titles, but I'm big on creative titles. So, I do like that. You've been wonderful with your time. You can each answer this question. It's my final wrap up question, because I always feel like there's a good learning inside a bad situation. And so, for each of you, and it can be personal, it could be professional. What's the worst piece of advice you've ever gotten that you said no to.
Tim Vennard 34:33
Want me to go first?
Ben Houck 34:34
Yeah, go for it.
Tim Vennard 34:36
Great question difficult to answer. But I would say for me, someone once said to me. ‘Don't sweat the small stuff.’ And then the next statement that came out of her mouth was, ‘but the devil is in the details.’ So, it was this perplexing comment and it's right, right. You sweat the small stuff you get caught up in all this crazy. You're trying to figure everything out on this on this micro level, you know. So, you got to be the macro. And then all of a sudden, you realize that if you don't pay attention to those details, then it all falls apart. So, that’s it. I don't know what it was. I don't know if I left it aside or not, Roger, but it was one of those conundrums that stuck in my head where you know. Don't sweat the small stuff. Pause. Then put the devils in the detail.
Ben Houck 35:18
I love that one, too, and I think you know Tim walks that walk. I love… Tim got kind of like a swagger as he goes through every unit we go, and I think people feel that in the and he embodies both those things. You know. I mean, he wants the bread to be his very specific way. But then he's also not worrying about like if someone's having, you know, or as small detail that might not matter right. Probably the piece of advice that I took that I did want to follow is one that one of my smartest college professors says, ‘it's time to go from being a consumer to a producer.’ And I did. I understand that like, it's time to go make your product your thing, and I think in order to be a good producer, you still have to consume a lot of things right, and especially in the food business. I think that’s how we get half of our best ideas; you know. I don't want to say we're faking it till we make it, but we go to find dining restaurants. We all travel, we all see the best in hospitality, and so I think it's just as important to be a consumer as it is to be that producer. And, do you know, be generative and have all these products that you could put your name on? I really think it's important to get out there and see what other people are doing in marketing and see what other people are doing in the hospitality space. And to not just be obsessed with production, production, production. You know? What I mean is, you don't miss the forest through the trees that way. If I can add one more cliche thing on there is, you know, it's okay to be a consumer and to enjoy your life, and to have all these experiences that inform who you are as a as maybe a company man or as a how you make your living.
Roger Hurni 36:43
Well, I think it's smart. I always love good advice inside of bad advice. Yeah, it just always works out. You have both been incredibly gracious with your time, and I know I need to wrap up, so it's been wonderful to speak with both Tim Vennard and Ben Houck from Mazzone Hospitality. Tim, Ben, where can people learn more about you and the Mazzone.
Ben Houck 37:06
Absolutely. I'm going to send you right to the website, mazzonehospitality.com. You can find us all over social media, whether it's YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, Mazzone Hospitality. And make sure you find our prime dining divisions, too. As that's where you're going to see more of that food-employee benefit side of it. Mazzone Hospitality, you know, come take a tour. Come see our spots. That's the other thing. We'd love to meet you in person as we love our digital spaces. Now, you can find us from anywhere in the world. But really seeing is believing. Come to Saratoga, upstate New York is beautiful. It's springtime. It's Tulip festival in Albany. Come see what we have to offer in upstate New York. We promise it's great, and you'll have a great time, and while you're here we'll take care of you.
Roger Hurni 37:45
Alright, I'm going to consider that as an invitation to me as well. So.
Ben Houck 37:50
The Belmont and the Saratoga Stakes are both in Saratoga this year, you know. Not everybody's into horse racing, but it's going to be a heck of an event we got a lot going on in the summer.
Roger Hurni 37:58
Wonderful. Wonderful! Well, thank you both again. Everyone I am, Roger Hurni, the host of From Persona to Personal. We'll catch you next time.
Outro 38:07
Thanks for listening to From Persona to Personal, the podcast that takes a closer look into how organizations personalize their marketing. We'll see you again next time and be sure to click Subscribe to get future episodes.
