Your Customer's Experience Starts With a Strong Set of Core Values With Andrew Jaffe, Chief Marketing Officer at Snooze an A.M. Eatery
Andrew Jaffe is the Chief Marketing Officer at Snooze an A.M. Eatery, a highly disruptive restaurant concept that seeks to evolve the morning dining experience through culinary innovation, friendly service, and an eclectic and energetic atmosphere. During his time with Snooze, the brand has grown from 20 to more than 60 locations. With experience in both large operating environments and entrepreneurial startups, Andrew is a savvy leader with expertise in building and mentoring teams to achieve their personal and business goals.
Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:
Andrew Jaffe tells the story of Snooze an A.M. Eatery and what makes the concept unique
The eight compass points that define the brand’s core values
Why Andrew believes a stack of pancakes can change the world
What were the lessons learned by Snooze during the pandemic?
Andrew discusses his marketing strategies
How Snooze utilizes its mobile app to enhance the customer experience
How to avoid waiting a long time to be seated on weekends
Why pursuing your passion is better than chasing a job for money
What you’ll learn in this episode:
The restaurant industry, perhaps more than any other, is subject to the whims and fluctuations of the market. With the potential instability that accompanies this reality, how can a restaurant concept maintain a level of service and products that provide an experience that keeps customers coming back?
As a senior brand marketing executive with a proven track record in consumer packaged goods and restaurant hospitality, Andrew Jaffe knows it’s essential for a brand to live and breathe its core values during both good times and tough moments. Snooze an A.M. Eatery has built its core values with eight compass points, including employees (aka Snoozers), guests, craveable food, passion, community, sustainability, individuality, and high standards overall. Especially during hard times, Andrew says Snooze — from its executive leadership team to everyone on its restaurant staff — puts these compass points at the forefront of what it does every single day.
On this episode of From Persona to Personal, Roger Hurni sits down with Andrew Jaffe, Chief Marketing Officer at Snooze an A.M. Eatery, to discuss reasons for the restaurant concept’s remarkable growth and rise to prominence over the past half-decade. Andrew emphasizes that Snooze’s core values are guideposts that have proven particularly valuable during times of adversity. He also talks about the effective use of the Snooze mobile app and how utilizing Yelp has helped keep guests happy.
Resources mentioned in this episode:
This episode’s sponsor:
Today's episode is brought to you by Lighthouse PE.
LighthousePE is an AI-powered marketing automation software for mobile apps. It creates one-to-one personalized messaging
and experiences that increase brand loyalty, provide competitive intelligence, and drive substantial revenue to your business.
LighthousePE accomplishes this by analyzing your customers’ behaviors and leveraging its onboard AI to automatically generate and deliver the right message at the right time.
To learn more, visit LighthousePE.AI
Episode Transcript
Intro 0:02
This is From Persona to Personal podcast. Today's episode is brought to you by Lighthouse PE. Lighthouse PE is an AI-powered marketing automation software for mobile apps. It creates one-to-one personalized messaging and experiences that increase brand loyalty provide competitive intelligence and drives substantial revenue to your business. Lighthouse PE accomplishes this by analyzing your customer’s behaviors and leveraging its onboard AI to automatically generate and to deliver the right message at the right time. To learn more, visit lighthousepe.ai. Now, let's get started with the show.
Roger Hurni 0:45
Hello, everyone, I am Roger Hurni, the host of From Persona to Personal where I get to use my expertise in consumer behavior modification to engage with top leaders helping their brands forward. Before I get to today's guest. This episode is brought to you by Lighthouse PE. Lighthouse PE is an AI-powered marketing automation software specifically for mobile apps. It creates one-to-one personalized messaging and experiences that increase brand loyalty provide competitive intelligence and can drive vast amounts of additional revenue to your business. Lighthouse PE accomplishes this by analyzing your customer’s behaviors, then using its AI it automatically generates and delivers the right message to each individual customer at the right time. To learn more, visit Lighthouse pe.ai. Now without further ado, I am super happy to have with me. Andrew Jaffe. I'm going to pronounce the name wrong Andrew correct me right now. Andrew Jaffe, Jaffe perfect. I apologize for that. Andrew is the CMO of the highly disruptive concept Snooze. It's an am eatery as they like to say, Andrew has been with Snooze for more than five and a half years helping grow the brand. During that time Snooze has gone from 20 locations to 61, which is quite an accomplishment. Andrew, welcome to the show.
Andrew Jaffe 2:14
Thank you. Thank you for having us, Roger.
Roger Hurni 2:17
I apologize for messing up your last name. I generally get something wrong in every show. And unfortunately, that was pretty worse. As a fan of Snooze, and that's in full disclosure because there's one a couple of miles from my house that I frequented. I think I know what makes Smith's News special. But I would like to hear it from you what, what's the Snooze story? And what's it? Why is it so unique compared to other eateries like that?
Andrew Jaffe 2:51
Yeah. Well, that's, that's a good segue get set up. I'm gonna I'm gonna take the story back a little bit. And I do think it, it harkens back to our foundation, to 2006 when, when the concept was started in your backyard. And it's kind of a beautiful union Yang story between Adam and Jon Schlegel, the two brothers, the founders. And you know, Jon very much had a passion for hospitality, he very much had a passion for the culinary side of things. He very much had a passion for this idea for e-comm. Anytime we referenced Snoozers those are our people, a lot of people refer to as employees, we refer to them as Snoozers. Many he had a passion for our Snoozers living a balanced life. And a lot of John's upcoming in the hospitality world harken back to kind of late night dinner type places, which often did not lead to leaving living kind of a balanced life. So that was a big piece of it, and have created a one-shift business for our Snoozers that you can go be passionate about what you do in the hospitality world, and then be at home with your family. And that was kind of balanced with Adam's vision, you know, how do we, how do we use business? How do we use the Snooze platform as a way to, to amplify initiatives with our nonprofits to amplify things that are going on in our communities in the world and social justice issues, and the environment? And so, you know, those two things together, I think started to encapsulate, you know, the snooze experience and a big piece of that kind of going back to the Souza piece you know really goes back to India. duality we have, we have eight compass points, you know that Jack that you see here. And, you know my background, I know that other person's background, but each one of those points, and our logo of that Jack is actually a compass, right? And each one of those points stands for something in our brand values
Roger Hurni 5:24
Don't leave me hanging what are the what are the what are the eight points because I, I think it's really a big deal when companies live and breathe their core values higher on them, they fire on them. And I don't want anyone to, to not get the benefit of that. So those eight points,
Andrew Jaffe 5:42
totally. So our guest is one of our main points kind of the the TrueNorth, which is balanced with our Snoozers as the other as the other main point. And those two are purposely kind of opposite one another. Because there's this beautiful partnership, we believe that that manifests between our users and our guests and, and I'll bring that full circle and talk a little bit about what that is. So those are two of the eight. The other, the other ones that we have our craveable, our food, and everything that we do needs to be craveable and have a little bit of a twist. Passion is another one. You know, I believe that people hopefully experienced at a town and country are Snoozers have a tremendous amount of passion. For Snooze, yes, but I think for life and the things that also that we are passionate about in our communities and the environment. Our community is the other pillar that other compass points, in terms of how we show up in our backyards. I believe our communities are better when businesses show up and give back and bring awareness to potential opportunities and issues going on in our communities. Sustainability is the other one being mindful of our impact on the planet. And individuality is another one, I think, you know, can you kind of see what's happening in the back of my, my screen here we go by the saying, you know, everyone is welcomed at our table. And I think this notion of individuality for us and is a really, really important aspect of our users and our culture and making sure they all feel welcome. And creating a safe space not only for them but for our guests. And then being the best of the best and holding ourselves to a standard. Realizing we're on our own journey, we're not always perfect either. But we're always striving to make progress and be better, be better for our Snoozers be better for our guests, the better for our communities, the planet. And so to your point that those, those really do become our values, our belief system. And during good times during hard times we rely on, on these compass points more than you know, from, from the executive leadership team, all the way down to the operators, the general managers that our restaurants and their and their teams, you know, having our compass points on our values at the forefront of everything we do every single day. It helps guide us. It helps guide us when things are good. And it helps guide us when you know we had some, some some tough moments.
Roger Hurni 8:28
What's the base of your culture? And I think it was Jack Welch. She said culture eats strategy for lunch. I mean, there’s so many businesses that they don't know how to make decisions in times of adversity. And they think when times are great, they're geniuses, but there's not a core set of values there that they can rely on to be that compass the way you have. So that's so that translates obviously the consumer experience because there's something that you have a mantra, you have a mantra of Snooze, and it only takes a moment to make a difference. Why is that important? Has that come off those core values?
Andrew Jaffe 9:02
Yeah, so that was one of our first mantras that mantra has been around from like, day one. It's funny, we just came back from our annual we called Study With a Fork of Vegas where we bring together all, all our jams, all our chefs, we had over 150 people there at the conference is a leadership conference. And the whole premise was all about making helmets and ladders up to the idea of it only takes a moment to make a difference. And I think it kind of started through this premise and you think about the hospitality world and think about whether it's a Snoozer at one of our restaurants or a guest just the, the power in checking in on somebody just by saying how are you doing today and the power that, that can have, whether it's your co-worker, fellow Snoozer, or so that might be coming to students and spending time eating at a table or at the bar. And figuring out these little moments whether it's us being curious, “How are you doing?”, “Welcome to Snooze”, whether it's celebrating a moment at Snooze, we have a lot of people come to celebrate their firsts. Whether it's a date, whether it's a wedding, you'd be shocked at how many people want to have weddings, or want us to cater Snooze. And, you know, in talking to our Snoozes and talking to our guests, they've often said, it's not about any one moment, it's about several little moments throughout that death journey that people have, and whether that's the connection that they've made be made with the host, we often hear the connection that our guests have with our servers and our Snoozers through our servers. And that's, that's the beautiful X Factor, I think, and a big part of our Snooze experience that we've allowed our Snoozers to kind of express their individuality, which in turn has created a comfortable, familiar place for our guests. And there's this beautiful relationship and repertoire that really begins to change our, our centers, and our guests. And it's these little moments for us. throughout that journey throughout that guest experience where we try to live that it only takes a moment to make a difference. And you could latch on to that all the way up to the things that we do in our communities, we do give 1% of our sales back and do donations and through monetary donations as well, which is which is a big piece, it only takes a moment to make a difference. When we think about how we show up for the planet. Things that we're doing almost 70% of our trash is being diverted from landfills. Today, composting programs are a big thing for us. So those are all the different examples are ways we think about making a moment or making a difference. They can come in many different shapes and forms.
Roger Hurni 12:06
That makes a lot of sense. Good companies do good. And it gives it gives me a it rounds off my experiences there. And it's tried and true to every engagement I've had with with your Snoozers. I knew I've got one other question about this this area before we move on to another topic. I'm very curious in my research. This is my favorite breakfast food. So this is why the curiosity is here. Why do you believe a stack of pancakes can change the world?
Andrew Jaffe 12:39
That's a great, so yeah, I mean, I read
Roger Hurni 12:42
that about you. I don't know if that's a Snooze thing. But it seems to be you.
Andrew Jaffe 12:45
Yeah, no, I mean, I think that's, um, I think it's an inspiration point. That's right. And sort of that metaphor of, you know, the power of bringing people together at Snooze, and the power that the pancake can have. Whether that's in our communities, whether that's on our, our Snoozers on personal trajectory and career at CES, whether it's a guest you know, whether it's what we do in our backyard, you know, as it relates to the planet and being mindful of our impact on it. And it's more of a metaphor for us of like, what we do at Snooze, breakfast is amazing, the pancakes, the bloody berries, the experience, but it's far bigger in terms of what it is that we're trying to do and the impact that we're trying to have in our backyards, in our users lives. So that's, that's, that's why we often say that, that a stack of pancakes can actually change the world. Now, the other thing I would say around that is, you know, having watched the business continue to grow, at least since the time that I've been here. So this, this notion of our ability to continue to grow, to give, to help kind of bring more awareness to that idea that a stack of pancakes can actually change the world because, you know, one restaurant is going to have a hard time really having a significant impact. And so we love the idea that, you know, with our growth that we've been on, that that gives us ability to have more influence and more change for good in our communities, and even in some of the broader, you know, macro issues that are happening out there. Well,
Roger Hurni 14:42
oh, well, that's great. I have to ask this because you've mentioned growth now several times in the bulk of your time, has been through the pandemic. And I know we're kind of on the other side of it, but you seem to have grown through that. And maybe it's me. But I don't really think of breakfasts as takeout food. So I'm kind of curious is like, how did you navigate the pandemic? And what were some lessons learned? And did anything carry forward? There's a lot to unpack in those three questions. And it just kind of curious on how the pandemic went for you and what you learned.
Andrew Jaffe 15:21
Yeah, I mean, just, I think there's just been some amazing unintended consequences in the industry that has come out of the pandemic, and most certainly for Snooze. And, and I think one of the most glaring things I can point to is, you know, prior to the pandemic, to your point, we were maybe doing 2% of our sales off-premise. And we were always talking about like, gosh, you know, like our four walls experience is so core to what we do, you know, can off-premise really be a big part of our business going forward. And, you know, when you think back to what unfolded in March 2020, we all basically became offices business overnight, and our off-premise, you know, shot up from call it 2%, when it is pre-pandemic, to where it's now settled today, you know, anywhere from 16 to 18% of our business, any given week, is off-premise. And that's a whole new platform for us that, I believe, is not only given the existing guests the ability to still have their Snooze experience and our ability to meet them where they are. And for some of those folks that is at home, or maybe at work, or wherever it may be. But I think the other the other piece for us was, it also forced us to have to transform the way in which, you know, we were developing our own technology stack, in order to meet our guests where they were, we had a very small period of time to, you know, stand up our technology stack, to be able to have an off-premise business, we had to very quickly evolve. And I would say, optimize our off-premise packaging, because we really hold ourselves to a high standard of that, that culinary experience, as well. So we wanted the packaging to emulate that. And we work very closely with our, our packaging partner here. That's just north of us here in Boulder, Colorado eco products. So we went through an extensive innovation process and creating package, packaging, specifically for many of our products. You know, being mindful of how our eggs travel, being mindful of how our holidays travels, you know, for a Benedict, and making sure we're getting intentional and thoughtful around some of that packaging. So the off-premise business piece, for sure has become a huge part of our business. And I think that really forced us from an innovation standpoint to have to really embrace it. And I think it's we're fortunate that we have
Roger Hurni 18:03
that's fascinating, fascinating. Well, we've talked about background, we've talked about operations, I want to get to marketing. I know you've got a really deep background in that area, your your pedigree sort of speaks for itself. kind of curious what in your time there. What have you found in terms of marketing to be your most valuable strategies for helping grow the brand? Yeah.
Andrew Jaffe 18:30
Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, it's interesting when you're part of these, what I would kind of call smaller entrepreneur, entrepreneurial growth brands. I think more often than not, there's always something really unique and disruptive about the brand. And I think, you know, Snooze has some of that cachet to itself. Everything we do has a little bit of a twist from a, from a culinary standpoint, I think about our culture and our Snoozers in terms of what that does, for the brand, I think about, you know, our perspective on the environment and community as another pillar of storytelling, but, you know, having to do it in a way that is entrepreneurial. And I don't know if I use the word scrappy all the time, but, you know, there's times we're having to, you know, we don't have really, really big budgets. And so I think for us, we often rely on the cachet of the brand we rely on our guests spreading the word word of mouth aspect of what we do. I think from a social media perspective, that is also a way in which we really continue to create that emotional connection with our guests and really leading with our culinary, really leading with our menu and brew really seeking to drive those experiences, I do think there's a lot of different senses that go into how people think about brands. We also eat with our eyes. And I think you know, how we show up in the Instagram world, how we show up in the Tick Tock world, I think for us is really, really intentional and making sure our food comes off comes across in a really amazing, beautiful way that that's going to engage our guests.
Roger Hurni 20:29
You know, I mean, and I appreciate all that you said, but you you can't do that. Unless you have a great customer experience. And it's one of the things that I've noticed is that your branding, a lot of it happens at the table. And I think it becomes the cornerstone for a lot of the other activities that that you talked about, and I don't I really see a lot of QSR errs, who don't You don't take that to heart. Yes, you seem like you do. Again, the core values, I think, you know, speak to
Andrew Jaffe 21:03
that. Yeah. And my bifocals, where you see that core value come across is some of the things we've talked about our compasses of our of our scissors, and that that guest experience. I think for us, it's something that we always talk about and letting our users have those connections and be really intentional about the connections that they're creating with their guests. Right, going back to those moments, only takes a moment to make a difference. And I think that is where it all starts. And I was saying earlier, there's a reason why we have our our guest is our true north and our Snoozer directly across that on our compass, because that is where that experience starts. And I think our hope is we can, if we can, you know, impact the guests live, when they come to Snooze and leave them feeling full with that experience, our hope is that they're just going to only want to sell 123 or their friends about that experience. And I think for a small growing brand, like attention to that is unbelievably important. So
Roger Hurni 22:15
looking toward the future now, every restaurant every QSR, and I don't throw you into the QSR category. So just I'm just saying I speak to a lot of things in the category. They're having a difficult time. A lot of people are translating that kind of customer experience to the mobile app, your your your off premise sales have gone on. So I'm kind of curious as to, you know, how do you see that playing a role in your overall amount of marketing and value propositions? How do you? How can you translate the in store experience to an app experience to help gain more loyalty? What's What's that look like in your quiver of arrows? Marketing? Arrows? Yeah,
Andrew Jaffe 22:58
no, great, great question. Right. And we actually talked about this during our study with the Ford conference last week. And I think what's, what's important, you know, we think about some of the different cohorts that are out there today that are important, you know, just news, and one of those cohorts is the Gen Z. And, you know, they are they make up almost 40% 47% of our, of our Snoozers, which is a huge number. So from a Snoozer employment-based perspective, but they're also a huge, huge portion of our guest base, as well. And I think about the Gen Z and the millennials in those two main cohorts. And you think about that Gen Z cohort growing up pretty much with a device in their hand. I think their expectations around how brands interact with them all really go through that device.
Roger Hurni 24:00
As the father of two of them, I can tell you right now, they totally grew up with their, their device in their hands, maybe that's poor parenting on my part, but you but you're right like they had.
Andrew Jaffe 24:07
So I just feel like, you know, even five years ago, I think the way in which we interacted and engaged with guests and consumers has evolved rapidly. And so you know, the fact that we have an app now the fact that we have our own loyalty platform woven into the app, we were really, really intentional about how we were building out that loyalty program to engage, you know, with our guests and our consumers. We talked about, hey, it's got to be Snoozey. Right? It's got to embody that experience. And so we have kind of a nice balance of, we know that people want experiences for food. You know, they want to experience the Snooze pancake. They want to experience a Snooze bloody mary and we do give them a thing but we also know that they want experiences and so giving them the ability to do You know, get into this new year with priority seating so they can get to their experience and that balance of giving them what I would say, you know, free, you know, free food or free options with also experiences for us has been really, really important to make sure we start to build out within our app within our loyalty program as we continue to evolve it so that way we are connecting,
Roger Hurni 25:25
are you starting to use it proactively as a way to build one-to-one communication? It's not just around loyalty, but, but reengaging. For, hey, you haven't been in, in three weeks, we'd love to have you come in here is 10% off. I'm not saying you would do a deal. But, but there's a there's the utilitarian part of it. And then there's this very proactive marketing part that people are trying to like pull value out about, is that on your roadmap?
Andrew Jaffe 25:51
Absolutely. And there's, you know, there's segmenting in different cohorts that we leverage and talk to guests in different way. And whether that's somebody who's been a lapsed guest versus somebody whose frequency is different, you know, frequency, it's more often we're communicating with them in a very different way. The other thing, it's actually allowed for us one of our, one of our biggest barriers is our weight on a Saturday or Sunday, that's probably one of the, one of the bigger friction points of
Roger Hurni 26:22
this experience, I will tell you, I have punched out a couple of times, because it's like, I just I couldn't do it.
Andrew Jaffe 26:30
And that's, and that's understandable. And trust me, we are trying to work through that as efficiently as we can. But one of the things that we've started to introduce in our partnership with Yelp is the ability to get on board get on our waitlist. Yeah. You know, and that, that has done a tremendous job and allowing us to get folks get to not see that weight is as big as the friction because if you're a young family or a couple, you can be at home getting ready, get on the waitlist, start to make your way to snooze, versus having to be right there at the restaurant. And that was very intentional, being able to create that accessibility and break down that friction for our guests.
Roger Hurni 27:16
Picture. I told my wife, the last time we were there, and there was a there was a long line. I said, I don't understand why I don't get a push notification that says, you know, like, I break the geofence of the parking lot like, hey, the line is x, we've got you on the waitlist already or, you know, something that morning, if I'm habitually there like every third Saturday, you know why there's not some proactive communication? Just, I'm not asking you to answer the question. I'm saying there's plenty of opportunity, I think for you a lot of restaurants to really provide that kind of outreach. And I think that that ends up future-proofing that customer experience. But it's also good that you get along line means you're popular, you know, and people want to go where food's great. So you know, when person looks up, and everyone starts looking up, one person's couple of people are in Lyons, like the food must be good. So it's, it's a good problem to have, that you have to carefully navigate.
Andrew Jaffe 28:16
And I think that's also meeting our guests where they are. That is something that we've heard loud and clear. And I think the evolution of our technology stack has been something that we've been really, really focused on the last few years.
Roger Hurni 28:30
Well, that's a challenge. But I'm kind of curious. What's the challenge that you're facing now? Or challenges you're facing now that keep you up at night? What's, what's the biggest thing on your plate now that you're like, I wish I could solve this, or this is the thing that, you know, we've got to get through what's, what is that?
Andrew Jaffe 28:48
Yeah, I mean, I think there's there's a couple there. You know, I think no different than any other battling some of the hangover from the COVID and inflation, some of the impacts that that has had around the business. I think from an inflationary standpoint, there's been this ongoing balance with how we are managing inflation in our cost of goods with price. And I think that that's something that all of us is restaurants and operators are really continuing to navigate. And I think at this point, you know, the guest has remained, we believe, fairly resilient. But I think what that often puts on us is well, if we are going to be taking rice, you were talking a lot earlier about this news experience, the food, the culinary side of things, we absolutely have to over deliver on that experience. You have to overdeliver on the on the culinary experience. We often talk about food service ambiance and those three things have to always, always, always be at the food were fun for us. And so, you know, as we continue to grow, and bring new Snoozers into our family, making sure that those decisions as well are, you know, locked in on our value system locked in on that priority of delivering the absolute best experience, I think is really, really important, especially on the growth trajectory that we're on. And I don't say that the growth is, is a challenge as much as we have to be really, really intentional as we continue to grow, staying, you know, tried and true to to our students value system. So that way, everybody gets that same amazing areas, whether you're in town and country, Arizona, or you know, Boulder.
Roger Hurni 30:44
You've been great with your time, there's been a lot of nuggets you've thrown out there for listeners. And so this is my last question. Because I think, you know, a lot of times what you don't do says more about you than what you do do. So I'm kind of curious as to what's the worst advice you've ever gotten?
Andrew Jaffe 31:11
The worst advice that I've ever gotten,
Roger Hurni 31:14
you give the same reaction that literally 99% gets, like, I've never been asked that before. And then I have to always start why you think? Yeah. Which is perfectly fine.
Andrew Jaffe 31:29
Gosh, the worst advice that I've ever gotten.
Roger Hurni 31:33
Hopefully, it wasn't your way of saying take a job at Snooze. So
Andrew Jaffe 31:42
it doesn't seem like it. Yeah, no, no.
Roger Hurni 31:45
It can make it personal. Mercurius you know, we've all been told really bad stuff. You know, I
Andrew Jaffe 31:53
Yes. I mean, I think that one of the things that often strikes me is I think having a you know, someone I think once told me that you know, going to work for a company and getting you know, getting all this money for the job, right? It's all about chasing the money. I can think about having grown up in New Jersey outside in New York City a lot of my friends stockbrokers Wall Street type folks and I feel as though that's that's not always the answer right to chase chase the dollars and and I think chasing something that you care deeply about and have passion around I think will always yield success in something that's that's true to your heart, I think is important. So that's probably one of the worst things. He chased the dollar. So that's not that's not always true.
Roger Hurni 32:49
No, and that's always true. My My dad used to tell me all the time, never ever take a job for money. It's only great for 90 days and after that things go downhill really, really fast. Yeah. I really appreciate the conversation today. Andrew. tell people how they can get a hold of you how they can learn more about snooze.
Andrew Jaffe 33:18
Gifts. Yeah, no know we'd love to we'd love to see. Guest it's Snooze. You can go to our website, you can download our app to join the join the waitlist, you can go to snoozeeatery.com where you can do both of those things. I think our other social medias, Twitter and Instagram. Spread the word and reached out to me as well and Jackie.
Roger Hurni 33:45
Thank you, Andrew again for being on the show. I am Roger Hurni, the host From Persona to Personal, we'll see you next time.
Outro 33:55
Thanks for listening to From Persona to Personal, the podcast that takes a closer look into how organizations personalize their marketing. We'll see you again next time and be sure to click Subscribe to get future episodes.
